Post: Reply | Quote

Interested in your opinions please...in Trinity I had such a multitude of characters that I found myself having to constantly keep track of them for timeline purposes. If one got out of kilter with the others than it had the potential to send the whole story awry. Luckily all of them behaved and were most obliging re when their personal trials and tribulations occurred. Having said that, I think you might all agree (correct me if I'm wrong) that essentially you could split the books into halves...(1) what was happening in Tor's story and (2) what was happening in Alyssa's story, both halves finally coming together in book 3.

And still I had to leap to different points of view and what was happening in various sub-plots.

Now....here's my query. In The Quickening there are only three main characters - Wyl, Celimus and Valentyna - and then a small number of secondaries who are important. I've almost finished Myrren's Gift and I've only really just realised that I am following only one character in an almost direct line. The other two are key players but not as important as Wyl Thirsk and the strange events in his life which affect the other two profoundly.

Does this matter to you as readers that you are sticking with one person's story and I'm not suddenly crossing to another's to update you? Their story depends on him anyway and his is the life where all the stuff is happening.

Post: Reply | Quote

I don't think it matters, does it?? I mean, whatever it takes to tell the story is all that matters. Trinity was, in esence, the story of Tor AND Alyssa. Perhaps The Quickening is turning into the story of Wyl, not Wyl and the others. Isn't it funny how these things work out?

..............................
"the universe we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil and no good, nothing but blind, pitiless indifference - Richard Dawkins
Asteroid B-612

Post: Reply | Quote

I agree with Lisa. It appears the focus of Myrrens Gift is Wyl. The fact that Celimus and Valentyna do not have a large part in book 1 does not mean that they are not integral to the story or that they will not play a larger part in the later books.

One of the joys of reading long stories is the fact that you get to know so many different characters - no matter how early or late in the tale they appear.

Post: Reply | Quote

Put aside the boredom factor. It's not even an issue.

Now, let's see: you'll be telling the story from Wyl's POV, introducing some other characters that will become important to your plotline, eventually. You'll be hinting at those characters for the whole length of the book?

*puts hands on hips and taps foot* And we'll have to wait yet another year to find out about those??? As if having to wait until August 2003 for this new book ain't enough?!? HAH!

">

Seriously... I think that depends on the length of the book. I'm not sure I would read the same character's POV for 900 pages, unless his story was a roller coaster. But then, Jacqueline Carey does it in her Kushiel books, and in first person POV at that! So, it's really a question of how intriguing the story is to keep the reader's attention as long as possible. I don't see that's a problem with your books, Fiona!

Edited by: Manon at: 8/29/02 12:44:01 pm

Post: Reply | Quote

Fiona

I will savour each one of those 18,000 words.

Post: Reply | Quote

Good point. It will be bit first personish without all the I did this, I did that. It just struck me last night that what I thought would be very similar in its make up to the last trio is turning into something so different.

Thanks all for the reassurance!

Post: Reply | Quote

What about the potential boredom factor of such a one dimensional story? I should qualify this by saying Celimus and Valentyna will become a lot more important and it's occurring to me (because I don't plan ahead) that book 2 may well focus more strongly on what is happening in V's life whilst book 3 will turn more attention onto C.

Wyl is the pillar, though. He is the story.

Post: Reply | Quote

Fiona

The story is everything, doesn't matter about POV as long as it is engaging.

Having seen your method is action, I will suggest that smaller characters will still play an important part... and you will surprise not only yourself but yuor audience.

I think as long as Wyl is in there and the motivation is consistent then it will be perfect.

Where there is a WYL... there is a way.

Post: Reply | Quote

I knew you would end up saying this.

Everyone else, of course, withstood the temptation but I knew you wouldn't be able to resist.

Post: Reply | Quote

As if there could be a boredom factor involved in reading your work!

Any boredom involved in reading a book comes not from the number of characters the story revolves around but from the quality (or rather lack of it) of the writing.

Post: Reply | Quote

BH

You know i could not resist... and I knew that I would, so I did not want to disappoint you.

Post: Reply | Quote

I'll just throw my .02 in.

I think sticking to one character mainly is fine. However, even if only for variation, you could consider certain chapters (or interludes) with these other characters.

Perhaps there are times when they're separated, and it would be interesting for the reader to have a glimpse into a thread from another reader's POV. Perhaps the main thread is slowing down a touch or the reader could simply use a break from the single POV. It can be quite interesting to see another piece of the story from another angle if it makes sense in the story's context.

That being said, there are plenty of books that stick to 1 POV for the entire story--1st person in particular, but many 3rd person, too. If it seems to make sense from Wyl's POV, then give him the stage. In fact, several books I've read suggest reducing the number of POV characters if possible. If Celimus and Valentyna can't state their arguments strongly for more page time, then they don't get it.

Cheers,

Brad.

Post: Reply | Quote

Yes Brad tell us all...

Pity you not in OZ mate, you would be published here for sure.

Also Fiona I think the concentration on Wyl sounds ideal and will be a surprise to your readership... it will be a change in style and make you a fully rounded writer..

Some writer's get lambasted because they tell story in same old style or even the same old story revisited...

You have chosen a different approach and I know it will be a sure fire hit...

I intend ordering it soon... put pressure on HC to get it into print.

Post: Reply | Quote

Yes, I agree with you. The point is that my stories don't often slow down and if I cop any criticism, it's usually that the pace is a little too fast. And unlike in the previous books where plenty was happening to so many of the characters all at once, the story is carried by Wyl. All that is going on of interest to the reader is happening around him. But being so close to it I am feeling suddenly nervous that I might risk the reader's indulgence.

Anyway, I'm 20,000 words shy of finishing it now so I probably won't go back and change its structure until the editor has seen it and given her thoughts. I won't be drawing attention to it - let's see if she picks it up.

Thanks for your comments - much appreciated. Tell me about Worldcon....what else happened? Any breakthroughs with the ms? Did you meet agents, editors?????

Post: Reply | Quote

Well, the con was great. I met Gordon Van Gelder, editor of F&SF. Very nice fellow. I saw Tom Doherty as well, though he was swamped every time I wanted to talk to him. There were several other editors (Ginjer Buchanon, Beth Meachem, Patrick Nielson Hayden, Jim Minz, and several others). For agents, I saw Joshua Bilmes, Ashley Grayson, and Eleanor Wood.

I was in a very weird (and unfortunate) situation. I've already sent in my current book to TOR, so I couldn't pitch it to anyone. The new book is not quite done yet. Just finishing the first draft. And the agents there had already sent a rejection for Blood of Rushma. So, I didn't feel ready to talk to any of them.

I still have some stage fright as well. It's like dating all over again. You don't want to annoy them, but you really, really want to get into bed with them (so to speak). I feel like just talking to an agent or editor is a bother for them, but I really have to get over that. And I will. When I have material to talk about, I'll get over that hurdle and make the pitch.

The other thing that's frustrating is that the panels (especially at a con as large as WorldCon) have *so* many people at them that getting time with the bigger folks is difficult. I want to try to sneak into a party or two during the next few cons and see if I can talk to people on a more personal level.

So, unfortunately, not much headway in terms of business progress. The soaking up writing knowledge was great thought. I think my favorite was Orson Scott Card's panel. He does this thing called 1000 ideas in one hour. In it, he takes the panel (there must have been 250 people in the room) through a creativity exercise. He has everyone blurt out ideas for an alien race, for example. What are they like? What's their social structure? How do the reproduce? Physiology, spacefaring or not, etc.

With each idea, he more or less ignores the first bunch of them, because they are the "off the top of your head" ideas. They're generally cliche. After a while, someone inevitably would come up with something interesting and he would ask why that is. More answers and he would ignore the first several.

The whole thing progressed and it became clear what his point was. When you're generating ideas for something in a book, you must never stop asking what and why. That is, during your career, don't fall back into the habit of grabbing the first idea that comes to mind. Keep questioning yourself until something clicks, and we all know the cool ideas when we think of them. Keep that one and explore it. Ask more why's.

After completing one exercise and telling people the technique, he did it one more time with a different subject. He's truly a great speaker. Funny and informative. Very insightful man. If you ever get a chance to hear him, do it.

That's my con report for now. Cheers all.

Brad.

Post: Reply | Quote

Plus Orson Scott Card is a damn good writer... I like that idea...
Bard don;t give up on Rushma.... it is damn fine piece of work... please keep up with it... and keep plugging away... never give up... never.

I for one would buy it.

Post: Reply | Quote

OSC sounds fantastic. I'd like to have been in on that session for sure.

I'm sorry to hear about the rejections and that's all I shall say because anything else will be cold comfort and I'll feel hollow saying it. You know we are all fully expecting you to succeed in this craft and I'm amazed you have so many pieces of work ready or almost ready to go. Prolific to say the least which is brilliant evidence of a fertile mind for stories.

Post: Reply | Quote

Writing a book is definitely a marathon -- it's the metaphor I use to explain how it feels to craft a tale. I write fast but that doesn't mean I don't feel daunted by the whole thing ahead. And so I have taught myself to concentrate on one sentence at a time...watch technique, stay focused - just like a marathon contestant who if they looked ahead to 20 miles still to go they might feel overwhelmed. Instead head down, one foot in front of the other and then suddenly when you do look up there's only one more lap to go, the crowd are cheering, you feel energised by seeing the finish line just 10,000 words ahead. Mind you, I do this quirky thing to myself which is to keep a daily total of words written and then a far more sick one where I keep a daily tally of words still to write. I set myself a goal from the moment I write Prologue or chapter one - usually around 130,000 - and I know it sounds sad but I get a thrill everytime I watch that figure reduce. I was telling Steve not so long ago that once I smash through the under 20,000 word barrier, I get a rush of energy.

Marathon indeed. And getting published for almost every writer can use the same metaphor.

You'll do it, Brad. You're already a writer - you're just waiting to be discovered (grin).

Post: Reply | Quote

Fiona,

I teell you what, forward me a copy of your manuscript and I'll tell you if there's a problem. ">

No? Oh well it was worth a try.

I don't see any problem with the one character focus. I've read many books that focus on one character and as long as the pacing is good - and we know you have no problem there - I don't see a problem.

I think you're just teasing us deliberately!

cheers,

Darren.

---

Life is a containment field for thought. (A Slatz original.)

Post: Reply | Quote

Thanks Fiona and Steve. The hill always looks large from the bottom.... Just have to keep plugging away. It feels like I'll get there, but I know it's a marathon, not a sprint.

">

Brad.